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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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hello and welcome to the skeptic zone

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episode number

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302

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for the 3rd of august 2014 richard

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saunders here with you from sydney

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australia

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another mixed bag folks another mixed

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bag of goodies coming up on this week's

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skeptic zone we're going to kick off

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with an interview with a lovely lady who

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lives right up in the far north coast

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area of this state new south wales heidi

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robinson is going to be chatting to us

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about the northern rivers

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vaccination

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supporters group

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now heidi is living in the area which is

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a real epicenter one might say for the

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anti-vaxxers

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and she and her friends have

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formed this group

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and in the interview you'll hear it come

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up with an interesting

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phrasing way to say it

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she said that she had to come out as a

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pro vaccination supporter

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that's just bizarre when you think about

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it and if you're living in that area of

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australia i think you'll be very

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interested indeed to learn more about

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the northern rivers

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vaccination supporters group following

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that it's evidence please with joe

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alabaster joe's going to be looking at

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the recent convictions

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into those ridiculous

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bomb detectors which worked on the

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dowsing principle

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fake as a

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i i remember when i was a kid hearing

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the term fake as a

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three pound note maybe i'm

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misremembering

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fake is something that's really fake

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joe's going to fill us in about the

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latest

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uh news concerning those and some

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convictions following that it's a week

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in science from the royal institution of

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australia

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i keep churning them out week after week

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well every week is a week in science i

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think

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and then after that details about how

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you can win

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a

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box set of the new cosmos series on dvd

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now this is only for australian

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listeners i'm sorry to say simply

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because of region issues

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uh but australian listeners if you want

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to win

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your own copy of the cosmos

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the new cosmos series courtesy of our

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good friends at the national geographic

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channel in australia

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keep listening for more details coming

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up later on in the show we're running a

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little bit of a competition then to

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round off the show it's a grain of salt

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with iran segev even more interviews

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from

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qed the um

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really good uh convention in manchester

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earlier in the year ron's going to be

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talking with

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rhys morgan the young

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reese morgan well he was young when he

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got into all this and he's still quite

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young

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that's to round off the show again a big

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thank you to all those people who have

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been plugging and watching and promoting

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the vaccination chronicles my little

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documentary

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i've been working very hard for the last

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week or so on the dvd

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of the vaccination chronicles which has

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extra features

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and what's taking up a lot of my time is

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actually putting in all the subtitles

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i've got the english subtitles all in

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the italian ones i'm nearly finished

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i've got about

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oh i don't know about

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five minutes worth of timeline time

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if you get my meaning to uh

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match up all the italian subtitles then

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i'll start work on the portuguese and in

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the coming week i hope to receive the

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whole hopefully spanish and french and

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german and

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norwegian and turkish i think something

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like that now this is all thanks to my

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good friend susan gerbic who has a

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worldwide network of people ready to

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help

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this translating which is just fantastic

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it's just a long

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process to match them all up correctly

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in the timeline and set them properly on

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the video

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all sorts of things like that

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but yeah when that dvd comes out i'll

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certainly let everybody

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know

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um it's um

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it's therapeutic in a way actually to

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do all this

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dvd work and subtitling work very

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interesting i'll be back later on with

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some news about james the amazing

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randy and his visit to australia some

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early information there but for now

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but for now i'm going to run downstairs

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i'm going to

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run out the door

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shake the coconut tree

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see if one falls down

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and indulge in some lovely

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homeopathic coconut water

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yeah

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well i try to work that one out i hope

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and joining me now from the beautiful

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far north coast of this state new south

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wales up in the area they call the

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northern rivers it's heidi robertson

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hello heidi hi

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waving hi you're waving but i can't see

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you because just a moment ago we turned

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off our skype cameras to save some

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bandwidth so i'll pretend i can see you

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waving you cut me off i'm making funny

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faces now

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thank you for having me again on the

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show that's all right i should turn on

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the camera again because you were on the

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show uh some time ago now in fact i met

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you at skepticam here in sydney

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very nice and you came up and wanted to

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meet me and say hello and i discovered

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that you're very passionate and very

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interested in promoting the cause of

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vaccination and in fact you're involved

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with the northern rivers vaccination

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supporters what can you tell me about

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that what can i tell you well um we

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formed in may of 2013 so we're just over

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a year old now um

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so

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i i moved up to this

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uh region in northern new south wales

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from sydney um

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and and my husband moved here from

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brisbane so

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this was our first sort of taste of

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country living and and we always loved

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the area but we had no idea when we

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moved here

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um that there was quite a strong

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anti-vaccination movement in the region

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no idea in fact i didn't even know until

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um

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my

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first son charlie who's now seven

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um started preschool when he was three

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years old and

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i um

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i was just chatting to one of the other

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mums and um

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she told me that she thought her

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daughter had mumps over the holidays and

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um me being quite naive about the whole

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thing um just sort of blurted out but oh

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your she would have had the the mmr

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wouldn't she and um mum just sort of

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looked at me and

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shook her head and and uh i was i was a

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little bit gobsmacked

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that was kind of the start of

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i sort of went home and i thought what

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you know what was going on there and

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sort of investigated a bit further about

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um

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you know

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um talked to some other people and i i

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just i sort of learned that there was

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this sort of strong anti-vaccination

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movement here

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um and i'd never come across anything

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like it before um i it just had never

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never occurred to me that

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um that this sort of um thinking was so

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prevalent um and especially in this area

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so anyway it eventually

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led me to join the northern rivers

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vaccination supporters group and we're

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just a group of community members um

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grassroots no funding um

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just a common common concern about the

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low vaccination rates in our region and

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you know as you know mullen bimby

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that's in this region has

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the dubious honor of having the lowest

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vaccination rates in the whole country

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so

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for kids

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aged up to five years of age um

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i think the vaccination rates are about

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48 percent

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which is um that's that's awful

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well it's all it's awful and it's

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frightening um

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considering that um a lot of the vaccine

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preventable diseases need a uh

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herd immunity of um

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they do and in fact it's interesting

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because that area you you talk of the

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far north coast and new south wales

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that's very close in fact it it

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bangalow is part of that area and that's

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where the uh australian vaccination

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network now the australian vaccination

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skeptics network is based

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yes yep and um yeah i had no idea about

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that when i first moved here but i sure

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do now

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um

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so

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i guess the purpose of our group is to

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well primarily to

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to give um

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to give people their voices back it's

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it really dumbfounded me when i moved to

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this area that it's um

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it's it's kind of a taboo subject to

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bring up vaccination people just don't

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bring it up

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um

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and

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so

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the the the anti-vaccination crowd that

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are around here are very loud

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and um they're very vocal and you find

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that even though the majority of people

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here still

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do vaccinate only just in mulan bimbi

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it's only

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just the majority

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um but they don't want to speak up

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because they don't it's a small

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community it's a different way of living

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in the country everyone knows everyone

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else

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and you don't want to be ostracized from

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that small community and so sometimes

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it's easier just to stay quiet

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but we've got to change we've got to

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change that because

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and i thought to myself and it was

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really scary for me coming out as a

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pro-vaxxer you know that's that's what i

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i sort of labeled it as it was like

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coming out

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and um

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and it was really scary and and then i

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thought no hang on why

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why should i feel this way it should be

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a normal thing it should be

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the shift has to change from it being a

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social norm to not vaccinate we've got

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to change this and if i want to raise my

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family in this beautiful region and i do

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i love it here

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00:11:30,870 --> 00:11:29,120
i can't just

287
00:11:32,710 --> 00:11:30,880
and whinge to

288
00:11:34,870 --> 00:11:32,720
to my family and friends about it i've

289
00:11:36,470 --> 00:11:34,880
got to get out and do something so

290
00:11:38,949 --> 00:11:36,480
we want to give the community the

291
00:11:41,190 --> 00:11:38,959
pro-axes in our community a voice and

292
00:11:42,550 --> 00:11:41,200
say look it's okay to say to get out

293
00:11:45,350 --> 00:11:42,560
there and say

294
00:11:47,430 --> 00:11:45,360
i vaccinate and it's okay to vaccinate

295
00:11:49,430 --> 00:11:47,440
and we want it we want to correct all

296
00:11:51,750 --> 00:11:49,440
the misinformation um that the

297
00:11:52,630 --> 00:11:51,760
anti-vaccination movement has put out

298
00:11:54,470 --> 00:11:52,640
there

299
00:11:56,550 --> 00:11:54,480
you know some of it's just ludicrous as

300
00:11:57,990 --> 00:11:56,560
you know um

301
00:12:02,550 --> 00:11:58,000
and

302
00:12:04,550 --> 00:12:02,560
we don't want to be confrontational we

303
00:12:07,910 --> 00:12:04,560
don't want to start a debate we're not

304
00:12:08,629 --> 00:12:07,920
interested in um creating a conversation

305
00:12:12,389 --> 00:12:08,639
with

306
00:12:14,550 --> 00:12:12,399
anti-vaccination crowd because

307
00:12:15,430 --> 00:12:14,560
we know we know that we'll never sway

308
00:12:17,110 --> 00:12:15,440
them

309
00:12:20,310 --> 00:12:17,120
what we want to do is engage with the

310
00:12:21,829 --> 00:12:20,320
people who are still unsure sitting on

311
00:12:23,670 --> 00:12:21,839
the fence they've heard this they've

312
00:12:25,190 --> 00:12:23,680
heard that and then just not sure which

313
00:12:27,509 --> 00:12:25,200
way to go

314
00:12:29,750 --> 00:12:27,519
they're the people that we want to um

315
00:12:30,870 --> 00:12:29,760
engage with and start a conversation

316
00:12:33,110 --> 00:12:30,880
with

317
00:12:35,350 --> 00:12:33,120
yeah absolutely right absolutely right

318
00:12:37,110 --> 00:12:35,360
and it's also interesting to to note

319
00:12:40,310 --> 00:12:37,120
that that area

320
00:12:42,710 --> 00:12:40,320
up there near the top of new south wales

321
00:12:45,269 --> 00:12:42,720
it's quite famous since the

322
00:12:45,990 --> 00:12:45,279
i guess the late 60s as being a sort of

323
00:12:52,230 --> 00:12:46,000
the

324
00:12:53,670 --> 00:12:52,240
capital of australia i haven't been up

325
00:12:55,829 --> 00:12:53,680
there for many years myself but i

326
00:12:57,030 --> 00:12:55,839
imagine that sort of feeling is still

327
00:12:59,590 --> 00:12:57,040
prevalent

328
00:13:01,670 --> 00:12:59,600
oh it is and you know what it's great

329
00:13:04,629 --> 00:13:01,680
you know in a lot of ways it's great you

330
00:13:07,269 --> 00:13:04,639
know it's the diversity and the talent

331
00:13:09,030 --> 00:13:07,279
and you know the the the artists and the

332
00:13:11,269 --> 00:13:09,040
musicians um

333
00:13:13,110 --> 00:13:11,279
the talent up here is great and i i love

334
00:13:14,470 --> 00:13:13,120
diversification you know what a boring

335
00:13:15,750 --> 00:13:14,480
world it would be if we were all the

336
00:13:16,949 --> 00:13:15,760
same but

337
00:13:18,629 --> 00:13:16,959
um

338
00:13:28,629 --> 00:13:18,639
the

339
00:13:39,030 --> 00:13:28,639
um

340
00:13:41,190 --> 00:13:39,040
and alternative medicine

341
00:13:42,310 --> 00:13:41,200
is rampant up here and

342
00:13:45,829 --> 00:13:42,320
and

343
00:13:48,710 --> 00:13:45,839
to a large extent i think

344
00:13:51,670 --> 00:13:48,720
i i try and have a

345
00:13:52,790 --> 00:13:51,680
tolerance to it but where my tolerance

346
00:13:54,710 --> 00:13:52,800
ends

347
00:13:56,310 --> 00:13:54,720
is um

348
00:13:58,150 --> 00:13:56,320
is when

349
00:14:00,829 --> 00:13:58,160
people are put at risk and especially

350
00:14:03,590 --> 00:14:00,839
babies and children that are relying

351
00:14:05,350 --> 00:14:03,600
on adults their parent their you know

352
00:14:07,670 --> 00:14:05,360
their parents or their guardians to make

353
00:14:08,949 --> 00:14:07,680
the best decisions for them um

354
00:14:11,670 --> 00:14:08,959
and

355
00:14:13,430 --> 00:14:11,680
i just can't i just i just can't bear

356
00:14:16,870 --> 00:14:13,440
that you know

357
00:14:18,550 --> 00:14:16,880
so if people are for instance using

358
00:14:20,310 --> 00:14:18,560
homeopathy and they're thinking that

359
00:14:21,829 --> 00:14:20,320
that is a viable alternative to

360
00:14:24,470 --> 00:14:21,839
vaccination

361
00:14:27,430 --> 00:14:24,480
i'm going to speak out against it right

362
00:14:31,829 --> 00:14:27,440
if i say you know if people aren't aware

363
00:14:35,829 --> 00:14:33,350
you know that

364
00:14:37,750 --> 00:14:35,839
that uh they're next to useless well

365
00:14:38,790 --> 00:14:37,760
they are useless they're not even next

366
00:14:42,629 --> 00:14:38,800
to you

367
00:14:46,069 --> 00:14:42,639
um not only do they not um do what they

368
00:14:47,670 --> 00:14:46,079
claim to do as far as teething goes

369
00:14:49,110 --> 00:14:47,680
but they're also a strangulation and

370
00:14:51,189 --> 00:14:49,120
choking hazard

371
00:14:53,269 --> 00:14:51,199
and that makes me angry

372
00:14:55,590 --> 00:14:53,279
but the vaccination thing is really my

373
00:14:57,590 --> 00:14:55,600
um my focus and trying to correct the

374
00:14:59,829 --> 00:14:57,600
misinformation around that but as far as

375
00:15:02,230 --> 00:14:59,839
that like i was just at a local fair

376
00:15:04,710 --> 00:15:02,240
today and there was there was music and

377
00:15:07,750 --> 00:15:04,720
there was artwork and and the sense of

378
00:15:10,710 --> 00:15:07,760
community is absolutely fantastic um if

379
00:15:14,550 --> 00:15:10,720
we can just turn around this um

380
00:15:17,670 --> 00:15:14,560
this trend um this part of the ideology

381
00:15:21,030 --> 00:15:17,680
up here that vaccination is a is an evil

382
00:15:23,110 --> 00:15:21,040
is an evil thing um you know

383
00:15:26,389 --> 00:15:23,120
and and why can't we do that there's no

384
00:15:27,829 --> 00:15:26,399
reason why we can't do that i think um i

385
00:15:30,150 --> 00:15:27,839
think i think you're absolutely right

386
00:15:32,150 --> 00:15:30,160
and i've been noticing on your group's

387
00:15:34,389 --> 00:15:32,160
page which is the facebook page northern

388
00:15:37,670 --> 00:15:34,399
rivers vaccination supporters

389
00:15:39,910 --> 00:15:37,680
uh there's um a campaign or a push that

390
00:15:43,030 --> 00:15:39,920
you're doing to put your flyers and

391
00:15:45,750 --> 00:15:43,040
leaflets up in hospitals and other areas

392
00:15:47,750 --> 00:15:45,760
yes and we have we've actually um we've

393
00:15:50,230 --> 00:15:47,760
been quite successful with that medicare

394
00:15:53,509 --> 00:15:50,240
local north coast medicare local up here

395
00:15:55,829 --> 00:15:53,519
um has heard about us and they have um

396
00:15:57,990 --> 00:15:55,839
they have kindly offered to we we had

397
00:16:00,069 --> 00:15:58,000
some flyers made up which we we we

398
00:16:01,110 --> 00:16:00,079
funded ourselves we we

399
00:16:03,430 --> 00:16:01,120
are not

400
00:16:04,470 --> 00:16:03,440
farmer shills or government shills we

401
00:16:06,470 --> 00:16:04,480
actually

402
00:16:08,870 --> 00:16:06,480
we passed the virtual hat around our

403
00:16:11,350 --> 00:16:08,880
facebook group we got the funds to make

404
00:16:13,189 --> 00:16:11,360
a few flyers up you mean you haven't got

405
00:16:14,069 --> 00:16:13,199
your check yet from big farmer i'm

406
00:16:16,870 --> 00:16:14,079
shocked

407
00:16:19,670 --> 00:16:16,880
i'm still waiting i'm still waiting

408
00:16:22,790 --> 00:16:19,680
um maybe one day i'll get drive around

409
00:16:25,590 --> 00:16:22,800
in that gold rolls royce

410
00:16:28,310 --> 00:16:25,600
not quite yet anyway so they they kindly

411
00:16:29,829 --> 00:16:28,320
offered to get our flyers out to

412
00:16:32,230 --> 00:16:29,839
70

413
00:16:34,829 --> 00:16:32,240
gp practices wow

414
00:16:38,150 --> 00:16:34,839
from grafton all the way up to tweed

415
00:16:40,949 --> 00:16:38,160
heads so we made some posters up as well

416
00:16:41,990 --> 00:16:40,959
so now the gps are all aware of our

417
00:16:44,389 --> 00:16:42,000
group

418
00:16:46,150 --> 00:16:44,399
and they can

419
00:16:48,470 --> 00:16:46,160
they can recommend

420
00:16:49,670 --> 00:16:48,480
parents or hesitant parents

421
00:16:52,310 --> 00:16:49,680
to us

422
00:16:56,150 --> 00:16:52,320
and they can be assured that

423
00:16:57,829 --> 00:16:56,160
we will give them credible information

424
00:17:00,389 --> 00:16:57,839
we'll we'll give them the credible

425
00:17:01,990 --> 00:17:00,399
websites to go to

426
00:17:04,870 --> 00:17:02,000
and um

427
00:17:06,069 --> 00:17:04,880
and we're there as a support for them

428
00:17:08,390 --> 00:17:06,079
and um

429
00:17:11,029 --> 00:17:08,400
to make sure that they know that they're

430
00:17:13,590 --> 00:17:11,039
not they're not alone and um that there

431
00:17:15,909 --> 00:17:13,600
is a great deal of support out there for

432
00:17:17,909 --> 00:17:15,919
them that's fantastic and i i like the

433
00:17:19,590 --> 00:17:17,919
flies too they look great the logo is

434
00:17:21,829 --> 00:17:19,600
really nice it's like a

435
00:17:23,909 --> 00:17:21,839
family and enclosed in these these two

436
00:17:25,270 --> 00:17:23,919
big hands to symbolize the protection of

437
00:17:27,829 --> 00:17:25,280
vaccination

438
00:17:29,990 --> 00:17:27,839
are your flies available online did you

439
00:17:31,270 --> 00:17:30,000
notice the dog in there i did notice the

440
00:17:34,789 --> 00:17:31,280
dog yes

441
00:17:36,950 --> 00:17:34,799
to vaccinate your pets as well yes um

442
00:17:38,710 --> 00:17:36,960
the flyers well

443
00:17:41,110 --> 00:17:38,720
if anyone is interested and actually

444
00:17:44,230 --> 00:17:41,120
that's a good idea we should

445
00:17:48,310 --> 00:17:45,510
i don't know what you call it a

446
00:17:51,830 --> 00:17:48,320
printable version i suppose of the flyer

447
00:17:55,110 --> 00:17:51,840
a pdf a pdf that's the one yeah

448
00:17:56,870 --> 00:17:55,120
yeah um we should put up that um

449
00:17:59,270 --> 00:17:56,880
that for people on our website so that

450
00:18:01,029 --> 00:17:59,280
they can download it print it yeah i

451
00:18:03,669 --> 00:18:01,039
would recommend it i think that would be

452
00:18:05,909 --> 00:18:03,679
um an excellent thing for you to do

453
00:18:07,590 --> 00:18:05,919
then people don't have to to wait for it

454
00:18:09,590 --> 00:18:07,600
if they want to put it in their local

455
00:18:11,029 --> 00:18:09,600
doctors or their local homeopaths and

456
00:18:13,110 --> 00:18:11,039
they can go right ahead

457
00:18:19,350 --> 00:18:13,120
yeah

458
00:18:21,430 --> 00:18:19,360
group have um have been putting the

459
00:18:24,390 --> 00:18:21,440
flyers up on various notice boards

460
00:18:26,150 --> 00:18:24,400
around the region um i've i've checked a

461
00:18:28,630 --> 00:18:26,160
couple of places lately that i put

462
00:18:29,990 --> 00:18:28,640
flyers up and they've been taken down

463
00:18:31,669 --> 00:18:30,000
but

464
00:18:33,669 --> 00:18:31,679
i've put them back

465
00:18:35,750 --> 00:18:33,679
back up again and

466
00:18:36,870 --> 00:18:35,760
we'll soldier on with it

467
00:18:39,510 --> 00:18:36,880
um

468
00:18:41,510 --> 00:18:39,520
yeah so yeah no it's good and look we in

469
00:18:45,110 --> 00:18:41,520
the past year considering the group's

470
00:18:47,750 --> 00:18:45,120
only a year old now we've actually um

471
00:18:49,510 --> 00:18:47,760
we've achieved quite a lot um

472
00:18:52,710 --> 00:18:49,520
you've probably heard that queensland

473
00:18:55,029 --> 00:18:52,720
has recently um announced that they are

474
00:18:56,950 --> 00:18:55,039
introducing a free whooping cough

475
00:18:59,510 --> 00:18:56,960
vaccine for

476
00:19:01,430 --> 00:18:59,520
pregnant women in their third trimester

477
00:19:03,909 --> 00:19:01,440
um so we

478
00:19:06,230 --> 00:19:03,919
we've recently written to the um

479
00:19:08,630 --> 00:19:06,240
to jillian skinner new south wales

480
00:19:10,390 --> 00:19:08,640
health about that and

481
00:19:12,150 --> 00:19:10,400
saying look come on let's do this for

482
00:19:13,990 --> 00:19:12,160
new south wales as well

483
00:19:15,990 --> 00:19:14,000
um so we're writing a lot of letters all

484
00:19:18,150 --> 00:19:16,000
the time um

485
00:19:21,669 --> 00:19:18,160
you know we've had interviews with

486
00:19:22,830 --> 00:19:21,679
abc north coast radio but we've appeared

487
00:19:25,190 --> 00:19:22,840
in

488
00:19:26,230 --> 00:19:25,200
the um

489
00:19:36,710 --> 00:19:26,240
the

490
00:19:39,190 --> 00:19:36,720
campaigns we've had stories our members

491
00:19:41,110 --> 00:19:39,200
have been in both those newspapers one

492
00:19:43,350 --> 00:19:41,120
of our members was recently on the 7 30

493
00:19:45,110 --> 00:19:43,360
report in queensland so we're getting

494
00:19:47,430 --> 00:19:45,120
out there and the

495
00:19:49,830 --> 00:19:47,440
really um another great thing is um

496
00:19:51,510 --> 00:19:49,840
alison one of our admins in our facebook

497
00:19:53,830 --> 00:19:51,520
group um

498
00:19:55,830 --> 00:19:53,840
got to do a poster presentation at the

499
00:19:57,029 --> 00:19:55,840
national immunisation conference in

500
00:19:59,590 --> 00:19:57,039
melbourne

501
00:20:01,350 --> 00:19:59,600
uh a month or two ago

502
00:20:03,430 --> 00:20:01,360
and that poster presentation she

503
00:20:05,909 --> 00:20:03,440
collaborated with a few other people to

504
00:20:08,310 --> 00:20:05,919
um to do that up including dr rachie

505
00:20:10,950 --> 00:20:08,320
who's been a great supporter like you

506
00:20:13,270 --> 00:20:10,960
have of our group absolutely

507
00:20:14,789 --> 00:20:13,280
so we got to um

508
00:20:17,270 --> 00:20:14,799
allison got to liaise with a lot of the

509
00:20:21,270 --> 00:20:17,280
big wigs in the uh

510
00:20:25,430 --> 00:20:23,830
but just to get out just just to get the

511
00:20:27,830 --> 00:20:25,440
message out that we're out there and

512
00:20:30,310 --> 00:20:27,840
we're around and um yeah so it's all

513
00:20:31,909 --> 00:20:30,320
going really well so far that's uh i'm

514
00:20:34,789 --> 00:20:31,919
delighted to hear it i'm delighted to

515
00:20:36,390 --> 00:20:34,799
hear it is the facebook group the the uh

516
00:20:37,669 --> 00:20:36,400
the portal is that where people should

517
00:20:43,750 --> 00:20:37,679
go

518
00:20:44,630 --> 00:20:43,760
facebook page um if they just um look

519
00:20:47,590 --> 00:20:44,640
for

520
00:20:50,470 --> 00:20:47,600
northern rivers vaccination supporters

521
00:20:53,750 --> 00:20:50,480
on facebook they can they can like that

522
00:20:55,830 --> 00:20:53,760
page and we've also got a website now

523
00:20:58,870 --> 00:20:55,840
the website one of our other

524
00:21:00,789 --> 00:20:58,880
gorgeous members um who's who's very

525
00:21:04,870 --> 00:21:00,799
good with this sort of stuff that we're

526
00:21:06,549 --> 00:21:04,880
not has offered to to revamp our website

527
00:21:09,270 --> 00:21:06,559
which is um

528
00:21:11,190 --> 00:21:09,280
which is now at

529
00:21:12,070 --> 00:21:11,200
nrvs

530
00:21:14,390 --> 00:21:12,080
dot

531
00:21:19,110 --> 00:21:14,400
info so northern rivers vaccination

532
00:21:24,549 --> 00:21:21,990
and as of monday

533
00:21:26,710 --> 00:21:24,559
this coming monday

534
00:21:28,590 --> 00:21:26,720
the old website address which was

535
00:21:31,510 --> 00:21:28,600
northern rivers vaccination

536
00:21:33,029 --> 00:21:31,520
supporters.org which was a handful

537
00:21:35,830 --> 00:21:33,039
mouthful

538
00:21:37,669 --> 00:21:35,840
will now point to that new

539
00:21:40,070 --> 00:21:37,679
that news site so

540
00:21:42,710 --> 00:21:40,080
it's a new revamped website it's got

541
00:21:45,750 --> 00:21:42,720
some stories on there of our

542
00:21:47,669 --> 00:21:45,760
admin members and why we joined and our

543
00:21:51,029 --> 00:21:47,679
our brushes with vaccine preventable

544
00:21:53,510 --> 00:21:51,039
diseases it's got lots and lots of

545
00:21:55,909 --> 00:21:53,520
links reputable links

546
00:21:59,350 --> 00:21:55,919
um and all about the different vaccine

547
00:22:01,190 --> 00:21:59,360
preventable diseases um so it's yeah

548
00:22:02,549 --> 00:22:01,200
urge everyone to to go and have a look

549
00:22:04,310 --> 00:22:02,559
at it and even

550
00:22:07,350 --> 00:22:04,320
recommend it to

551
00:22:09,190 --> 00:22:07,360
to your friends and family if you um

552
00:22:10,549 --> 00:22:09,200
if if you have friends and family that

553
00:22:15,190 --> 00:22:10,559
are

554
00:22:17,990 --> 00:22:15,200
in the issue of vaccination

555
00:22:20,310 --> 00:22:18,000
absolutely so folks if you are up in the

556
00:22:22,149 --> 00:22:20,320
north coast and far northern coast of

557
00:22:24,310 --> 00:22:22,159
new south wales the northern rivers or

558
00:22:25,990 --> 00:22:24,320
in southern queensland the website to

559
00:22:26,870 --> 00:22:26,000
visit is nr r

560
00:22:29,110 --> 00:22:26,880
v

561
00:22:34,390 --> 00:22:29,120
s dot info

562
00:22:36,230 --> 00:22:34,400
remember that one

563
00:22:38,710 --> 00:22:36,240
where you can find out about the group

564
00:22:41,190 --> 00:22:38,720
its actions and more about the

565
00:22:43,350 --> 00:22:41,200
vaccination some good advice heidi it's

566
00:22:47,190 --> 00:22:43,360
wonderful to have people up there in the

567
00:22:52,470 --> 00:22:50,230
yeah well someone had to do it

568
00:22:54,470 --> 00:22:52,480
no it's a beautiful area and

569
00:22:57,510 --> 00:22:54,480
we want to live here and we want to

570
00:23:00,230 --> 00:22:57,520
change change the way um it is up here

571
00:23:02,549 --> 00:23:00,240
so uh yeah please come and like our

572
00:23:05,750 --> 00:23:02,559
facebook page and um

573
00:23:07,669 --> 00:23:05,760
and uh tell everyone about us and um

574
00:23:09,669 --> 00:23:07,679
everyone's more than welcome to we've

575
00:23:11,430 --> 00:23:09,679
also got a contact form on our website

576
00:23:13,510 --> 00:23:11,440
page so if you've got any questions

577
00:23:15,110 --> 00:23:13,520
we're more than happy to uh to answer

578
00:23:17,029 --> 00:23:15,120
those questions as well

579
00:23:18,789 --> 00:23:17,039
fantastic well really nice to catch up

580
00:23:20,390 --> 00:23:18,799
with you heidi i hope we can

581
00:23:22,310 --> 00:23:20,400
bump into each other again at a

582
00:23:25,029 --> 00:23:22,320
convention or a skeptic camp or

583
00:23:27,190 --> 00:23:25,039
something in the not too distant future

584
00:23:29,110 --> 00:23:27,200
but for now a big thank you for all your

585
00:23:31,590 --> 00:23:29,120
work and the group up there

586
00:23:46,710 --> 00:23:31,600
heidi robertson thank you very much

587
00:23:51,350 --> 00:23:49,110
is an award-winning weekly science show

588
00:23:52,950 --> 00:23:51,360
in french hosted by a bunch of crazy

589
00:23:55,430 --> 00:23:52,960
enthusiasts

590
00:23:57,750 --> 00:23:55,440
we are convinced that the greatest ideas

591
00:23:59,750 --> 00:23:57,760
in science are quite easy to grasp as

592
00:24:02,310 --> 00:23:59,760
long as they are presented with passion

593
00:24:04,789 --> 00:24:02,320
using a vocabulary common to all curious

594
00:24:06,070 --> 00:24:04,799
minds whatever their academic background

595
00:24:08,149 --> 00:24:06,080
if any

596
00:24:09,510 --> 00:24:08,159
you don't understand french yet but it's

597
00:24:11,110 --> 00:24:09,520
never too late

598
00:24:12,870 --> 00:24:11,120
all our stories have a written

599
00:24:15,029 --> 00:24:12,880
transcript on the website and people

600
00:24:17,669 --> 00:24:15,039
from all around the world are using our

601
00:24:20,310 --> 00:24:17,679
content to learn molia's language

602
00:24:22,990 --> 00:24:20,320
our topics range from zero to infinity

603
00:24:24,789 --> 00:24:23,000
from evolution to artificial life from

604
00:24:26,070 --> 00:24:24,799
electromagnetism to the science of

605
00:24:28,549 --> 00:24:26,080
introverts

606
00:24:32,149 --> 00:24:28,559
we just love mathematics science

607
00:24:33,909 --> 00:24:32,159
critical thinking so do you want to join

608
00:24:35,909 --> 00:24:33,919
you can subscribe to the podcast for

609
00:24:39,029 --> 00:24:35,919
free from our website podcast science

610
00:24:41,750 --> 00:24:39,039
dot fm that's in one word you also find

611
00:24:43,549 --> 00:24:41,760
us on itunes and soundcloud see you soon

612
00:24:59,029 --> 00:24:43,559
hopefully at the

613
00:25:03,029 --> 00:25:01,029
what we want is some more

614
00:25:11,590 --> 00:25:03,039
evidence please

615
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:17,510
hello this is joe alabaster

616
00:25:21,350 --> 00:25:19,269
in news from the united kingdom this

617
00:25:24,549 --> 00:25:21,360
week a couple who made fake bomb

618
00:25:27,269 --> 00:25:24,559
detectors have been convicted of fraud

619
00:25:29,909 --> 00:25:27,279
sam and joan tree a couple in their 60s

620
00:25:32,549 --> 00:25:29,919
from bedfordshire constructed each alpha

621
00:25:35,190 --> 00:25:32,559
6 device from a plastic handle with a

622
00:25:37,029 --> 00:25:35,200
slot for a card and a metal aerial in

623
00:25:39,669 --> 00:25:37,039
their garden shed

624
00:25:42,390 --> 00:25:39,679
these components sourced from china only

625
00:25:44,710 --> 00:25:42,400
cost around 5 pounds a set but the trees

626
00:25:48,230 --> 00:25:44,720
sold the assembled devices for up to

627
00:25:50,470 --> 00:25:48,240
over two thousand dollars australian

628
00:25:52,630 --> 00:25:50,480
the trees and their distributor simon

629
00:25:54,310 --> 00:25:52,640
sherrard claimed that the alpha six

630
00:25:56,549 --> 00:25:54,320
molecular detector could detect

631
00:25:59,430 --> 00:25:56,559
explosives and drugs in quantities as

632
00:26:02,230 --> 00:25:59,440
tiny as 15 billionths of a gram at a

633
00:26:04,630 --> 00:26:02,240
range of 300 meters using magnetic

634
00:26:06,789 --> 00:26:04,640
molecular resonance and powered by an

635
00:26:09,269 --> 00:26:06,799
induced current from static electricity

636
00:26:11,510 --> 00:26:09,279
generated by the user's body

637
00:26:13,590 --> 00:26:11,520
the trees also claimed that the alpha 6

638
00:26:15,269 --> 00:26:13,600
could detect missing persons and gained

639
00:26:17,190 --> 00:26:15,279
much publicity when they used the

640
00:26:19,830 --> 00:26:17,200
devices to look for missing child

641
00:26:21,990 --> 00:26:19,840
madeleine mccann

642
00:26:24,470 --> 00:26:22,000
the promotional literature compares the

643
00:26:27,350 --> 00:26:24,480
alpha 6 device's operating mechanism to

644
00:26:29,590 --> 00:26:27,360
that of an mri machine a large medical

645
00:26:31,909 --> 00:26:29,600
appliance with sizeable magnets high

646
00:26:35,029 --> 00:26:31,919
energy requirements and short operating

647
00:26:37,190 --> 00:26:35,039
time and claims that the alpha 6 a tiny

648
00:26:39,029 --> 00:26:37,200
little handheld plastic box powered only

649
00:26:41,510 --> 00:26:39,039
by the currents emanating from the human

650
00:26:45,110 --> 00:26:41,520
body is able to recognize molecules of

651
00:26:47,029 --> 00:26:45,120
substances at a 300 meter distance

652
00:26:48,710 --> 00:26:47,039
one might assume that the alpha six

653
00:26:50,870 --> 00:26:48,720
contained some complicated inner

654
00:26:52,789 --> 00:26:50,880
workings to accomplish this feat

655
00:26:55,430 --> 00:26:52,799
promotional material states that the

656
00:26:57,110 --> 00:26:55,440
handle contains an inductor a conductor

657
00:26:59,750 --> 00:26:57,120
and an oscillator

658
00:27:01,590 --> 00:26:59,760
quote the oscillator within the alpha 6

659
00:27:03,750 --> 00:27:01,600
is programmed to oscillate at the same

660
00:27:06,470 --> 00:27:03,760
frequency as that of the substance to be

661
00:27:08,149 --> 00:27:06,480
located end quote

662
00:27:10,549 --> 00:27:08,159
strangely enough when the trees were

663
00:27:12,950 --> 00:27:10,559
investigated the majority of the plastic

664
00:27:15,590 --> 00:27:12,960
handles of assembled alpha 6 devices

665
00:27:18,710 --> 00:27:15,600
were found to be empty save a few which

666
00:27:21,029 --> 00:27:18,720
contained torn up scraps of paper

667
00:27:23,669 --> 00:27:21,039
the alpha 6 is set to detect specific

668
00:27:25,430 --> 00:27:23,679
substances by inserting a designated

669
00:27:26,710 --> 00:27:25,440
card into the plastic handle of the

670
00:27:28,310 --> 00:27:26,720
device

671
00:27:30,310 --> 00:27:28,320
these cards have apparently had the

672
00:27:31,750 --> 00:27:30,320
signature of a substance transferred

673
00:27:33,590 --> 00:27:31,760
onto them

674
00:27:36,149 --> 00:27:33,600
then the user holds the device by the

675
00:27:38,390 --> 00:27:36,159
plastic handle in front of them while

676
00:27:40,470 --> 00:27:38,400
the freely moving hinged metal aerial

677
00:27:42,470 --> 00:27:40,480
detects substances

678
00:27:44,230 --> 00:27:42,480
swinging left to right revealing the

679
00:27:45,590 --> 00:27:44,240
direction in which the substance is to

680
00:27:47,750 --> 00:27:45,600
be found

681
00:27:48,870 --> 00:27:47,760
the user walks and follows the swinging

682
00:27:51,909 --> 00:27:48,880
antenna

683
00:27:54,230 --> 00:27:51,919
is this starting to sound familiar yet

684
00:27:56,870 --> 00:27:54,240
the alpha 6 is working on the same

685
00:27:58,789 --> 00:27:56,880
principles as a dowsing rod the user

686
00:28:01,190 --> 00:27:58,799
experiences sensory cues from the

687
00:28:03,269 --> 00:28:01,200
swinging metal or rod caused by slight

688
00:28:05,430 --> 00:28:03,279
movements made unconsciously by the user

689
00:28:07,430 --> 00:28:05,440
themself or their surroundings and

690
00:28:08,950 --> 00:28:07,440
perceives these as the rod moving of its

691
00:28:11,110 --> 00:28:08,960
own accord

692
00:28:13,350 --> 00:28:11,120
between the expectations of the user

693
00:28:15,110 --> 00:28:13,360
perhaps influenced by the high financial

694
00:28:17,590 --> 00:28:15,120
and or emotional investment in the

695
00:28:19,830 --> 00:28:17,600
device combined with their trust in the

696
00:28:22,310 --> 00:28:19,840
vendor and their claims and a touch of

697
00:28:24,789 --> 00:28:22,320
confirmation bias people can perceive

698
00:28:26,789 --> 00:28:24,799
that dowsing rods work despite there

699
00:28:29,350 --> 00:28:26,799
being neither a proven mechanism by

700
00:28:32,149 --> 00:28:29,360
which this is possible nor a greater hit

701
00:28:33,750 --> 00:28:32,159
rate than that of chance

702
00:28:35,909 --> 00:28:33,760
there is a history of military and

703
00:28:37,510 --> 00:28:35,919
police forces investing in and applying

704
00:28:39,830 --> 00:28:37,520
dowsing devices

705
00:28:41,830 --> 00:28:39,840
during the vietnam war some u.s marines

706
00:28:43,430 --> 00:28:41,840
were using dowsing to attempt to locate

707
00:28:46,070 --> 00:28:43,440
weapons and tunnels

708
00:28:47,990 --> 00:28:46,080
in 1986 the norwegian army attempted to

709
00:28:49,510 --> 00:28:48,000
locate soldiers buried in an avalanche

710
00:28:52,630 --> 00:28:49,520
using dowsing

711
00:28:54,870 --> 00:28:52,640
and in 2007 the government of thailand's

712
00:28:58,149 --> 00:28:54,880
office of the narcotics control board

713
00:29:00,630 --> 00:28:58,159
bought 15 alpha 6 devices reportedly at

714
00:29:03,110 --> 00:29:00,640
over thirteen thousand dollars apiece

715
00:29:05,669 --> 00:29:03,120
and thailand's interior ministry bought

716
00:29:08,230 --> 00:29:05,679
four hundred and seventy nine alpha six

717
00:29:10,549 --> 00:29:08,240
devices at twenty four thousand dollars

718
00:29:12,549 --> 00:29:10,559
apiece that's almost one and a half

719
00:29:14,549 --> 00:29:12,559
million dollars all up

720
00:29:17,110 --> 00:29:14,559
which they've implemented to combat drug

721
00:29:18,549 --> 00:29:17,120
trafficking and smuggling

722
00:29:20,710 --> 00:29:18,559
that's a lot of money for a small

723
00:29:22,470 --> 00:29:20,720
plastic box an aerial with no better

724
00:29:24,870 --> 00:29:22,480
detection rate than that of random

725
00:29:26,789 --> 00:29:24,880
chance and a false sense of security

726
00:29:29,029 --> 00:29:26,799
that narcotics were not being smuggled

727
00:29:31,190 --> 00:29:29,039
through their country

728
00:29:32,950 --> 00:29:31,200
that false sense of security is perhaps

729
00:29:34,870 --> 00:29:32,960
even more dire for those who purchased

730
00:29:37,029 --> 00:29:34,880
the alpha 6 devices for their other

731
00:29:38,630 --> 00:29:37,039
purported purpose detection of

732
00:29:40,470 --> 00:29:38,640
explosives

733
00:29:42,470 --> 00:29:40,480
when checkpoint operators in warthorn

734
00:29:44,470 --> 00:29:42,480
areas are relying on a scam device to

735
00:29:47,990 --> 00:29:44,480
detect car bombs and the like the

736
00:29:50,230 --> 00:29:48,000
results can and have been deadly

737
00:29:52,630 --> 00:29:50,240
the alpha six is not the only bobus bomb

738
00:29:54,870 --> 00:29:52,640
detector that's been around recently

739
00:29:57,350 --> 00:29:54,880
similar devices were sold to iraq by

740
00:29:59,510 --> 00:29:57,360
british con man james mccormack who was

741
00:30:02,070 --> 00:29:59,520
sentenced to 10 years prison on three

742
00:30:05,669 --> 00:30:02,080
counts of fraud last year

743
00:30:07,590 --> 00:30:05,679
one of mccormack's devices the ade-101

744
00:30:10,549 --> 00:30:07,600
the handle of which looks near identical

745
00:30:13,990 --> 00:30:10,559
to the alpha 6 was in fact a rebranded

746
00:30:16,070 --> 00:30:14,000
novelty golf ball detector

747
00:30:18,630 --> 00:30:16,080
during their trial the trees maintained

748
00:30:20,710 --> 00:30:18,640
that the alpha 6 did work

749
00:30:23,830 --> 00:30:20,720
they've been convicted of fraud and are

750
00:30:25,669 --> 00:30:23,840
due to be sentenced next month

751
00:30:27,350 --> 00:30:25,679
australian listeners if you're not

752
00:30:29,590 --> 00:30:27,360
already familiar with it

753
00:30:31,830 --> 00:30:29,600
scam watch is an excellent website to

754
00:30:34,070 --> 00:30:31,840
visit with information for consumers and

755
00:30:35,510 --> 00:30:34,080
small business on how to recognize and

756
00:30:37,510 --> 00:30:35,520
avoid scams

757
00:30:39,590 --> 00:30:37,520
plus a database of common scams

758
00:30:41,430 --> 00:30:39,600
operating in australia

759
00:30:43,750 --> 00:30:41,440
run by the australian competition and

760
00:30:45,830 --> 00:30:43,760
consumer commission scam watch has a

761
00:30:47,430 --> 00:30:45,840
simple reporting function by which you

762
00:30:49,669 --> 00:30:47,440
can alert the a triple c to any

763
00:30:51,029 --> 00:30:49,679
fraudulent items or practices you come

764
00:30:52,870 --> 00:30:51,039
across

765
00:30:59,110 --> 00:30:52,880
scam watchers url is

766
00:31:04,070 --> 00:31:01,269
this has been joe alabaster

767
00:31:21,430 --> 00:31:04,080
you can visit my blog evidence please at

768
00:31:25,909 --> 00:31:23,590
ad hominem begging the question factoid

769
00:31:27,830 --> 00:31:25,919
propagation false analogy false cause

770
00:31:29,510 --> 00:31:27,840
false dichotomy gibberish immunized

771
00:31:31,190 --> 00:31:29,520
hypothesis moral equivalence poisoning

772
00:31:33,830 --> 00:31:31,200
the wells implemented certitude stacking

773
00:31:35,669 --> 00:31:33,840
a deck and wtf are just some of the

774
00:31:38,389 --> 00:31:35,679
fallacies we provide real-life examples

775
00:31:39,750 --> 00:31:38,399
of in hunting humbug 101 a podcast about

776
00:31:40,470 --> 00:31:39,760
bad arguments

777
00:31:53,750 --> 00:31:40,480
check it out at

778
00:31:57,830 --> 00:31:56,149
welcome to a week in science from ros

779
00:32:01,190 --> 00:31:57,840
bringing you the science you need to

780
00:32:03,830 --> 00:32:01,200
know the human body is pretty weird like

781
00:32:09,830 --> 00:32:03,840
freaky weird here's some of our favorite

782
00:32:13,990 --> 00:32:11,669
the most amazing part of the human body

783
00:32:16,710 --> 00:32:14,000
is definitely the brain it is made up of

784
00:32:18,389 --> 00:32:16,720
around 86 billion neurons if you were to

785
00:32:20,789 --> 00:32:18,399
count them it would take around two and

786
00:32:23,509 --> 00:32:20,799
a half thousand years to run all those

787
00:32:25,750 --> 00:32:23,519
neurons the brain uses around 300 to 500

788
00:32:28,230 --> 00:32:25,760
calories of energy per day about the

789
00:32:30,230 --> 00:32:28,240
same as a 15 watt light bulb that all

790
00:32:32,149 --> 00:32:30,240
seems rather efficient to me

791
00:32:33,830 --> 00:32:32,159
the speed that nerves carry information

792
00:32:35,830 --> 00:32:33,840
to and from the brain depends on their

793
00:32:38,149 --> 00:32:35,840
thickness with thicker nerves carrying

794
00:32:40,149 --> 00:32:38,159
information faster than thinner the

795
00:32:43,269 --> 00:32:40,159
thickest nerves can carry information at

796
00:32:45,190 --> 00:32:43,279
around 400 kilometers per hour and with

797
00:32:47,509 --> 00:32:45,200
all that brain power and computational

798
00:32:49,990 --> 00:32:47,519
ability a study has shown that men think

799
00:32:52,230 --> 00:32:50,000
about sex on average about 34 times a

800
00:32:55,990 --> 00:32:52,240
day which is about the same we think

801
00:32:57,990 --> 00:32:56,000
about food or sleep

802
00:32:59,750 --> 00:32:58,000
circulatory system is pretty amazing as

803
00:33:01,909 --> 00:32:59,760
well if you were to take all of your

804
00:33:03,110 --> 00:33:01,919
blood vessels and lay them end to end

805
00:33:05,190 --> 00:33:03,120
you'd die

806
00:33:07,430 --> 00:33:05,200
but those blood vessels would also reach

807
00:33:10,230 --> 00:33:07,440
a hundred thousand kilometers that's

808
00:33:12,149 --> 00:33:10,240
around the world two and a half times

809
00:33:14,070 --> 00:33:12,159
the heart is the hardest working muscle

810
00:33:16,789 --> 00:33:14,080
in the body beating a hundred thousand

811
00:33:19,509 --> 00:33:16,799
times each day that adds up to three

812
00:33:21,669 --> 00:33:19,519
billion beets over a lifetime at rest

813
00:33:24,310 --> 00:33:21,679
the heart pumps around 70 milliliters of

814
00:33:26,470 --> 00:33:24,320
blood each beat this means the heart

815
00:33:28,470 --> 00:33:26,480
pumps around 5 litres of blood every

816
00:33:30,870 --> 00:33:28,480
minute however this increases

817
00:33:33,350 --> 00:33:30,880
dramatically during exercise and for

818
00:33:35,269 --> 00:33:33,360
trained athletes even more the pressure

819
00:33:37,029 --> 00:33:35,279
at which it pumps the blood is also very

820
00:33:39,830 --> 00:33:37,039
impressive it is said that the heart

821
00:33:42,070 --> 00:33:39,840
could squirt blood around nine meters

822
00:33:44,789 --> 00:33:42,080
and now four fast facts about the weird

823
00:33:49,029 --> 00:33:46,389
fingernails grow around three

824
00:33:51,509 --> 00:33:49,039
millimeters per month that's about three

825
00:33:54,470 --> 00:33:51,519
times faster than toenails hair on the

826
00:33:56,950 --> 00:33:54,480
other hand grows very quickly about 1.25

827
00:33:59,190 --> 00:33:56,960
centimeters each month people who are

828
00:34:01,590 --> 00:33:59,200
deaf due to inner ear damage don't get

829
00:34:03,350 --> 00:34:01,600
seasick and just like your fingerprints

830
00:34:06,070 --> 00:34:03,360
your tongue's design is completely

831
00:34:08,149 --> 00:34:06,080
unique to you that's it for this week in

832
00:34:10,470 --> 00:34:08,159
science if your brain is intrigued by

833
00:34:13,669 --> 00:34:10,480
the weird human body go to the rl's

834
00:34:14,710 --> 00:34:13,679
website riaus.org

835
00:34:17,349 --> 00:34:14,720
a u

836
00:34:19,669 --> 00:34:17,359
follow us on twitter at rios and like us

837
00:34:32,470 --> 00:34:19,679
on facebook i'm ben lewis and we'll

838
00:34:39,990 --> 00:34:35,589
this is the cosmos

839
00:34:42,550 --> 00:34:40,000
a network of a hundred billion galaxies

840
00:35:01,750 --> 00:34:42,560
and it's the greatest story science has

841
00:35:06,230 --> 00:35:03,910
life on earth is one of the unsolved

842
00:35:07,349 --> 00:35:06,240
mysteries of science

843
00:35:08,470 --> 00:35:07,359
come with me

844
00:35:13,910 --> 00:35:08,480
our journey

845
00:35:18,790 --> 00:35:16,150
australian listeners is your chance to

846
00:35:22,230 --> 00:35:18,800
own your very own copy of cosmos a

847
00:35:23,589 --> 00:35:22,240
space-time odyssey on dvd courtesy of

848
00:35:25,990 --> 00:35:23,599
our good friends at the national

849
00:35:28,150 --> 00:35:26,000
geographic channel in australia three

850
00:35:31,510 --> 00:35:28,160
decades after the debut of the original

851
00:35:32,950 --> 00:35:31,520
cosmos it is time once again to set sail

852
00:35:35,430 --> 00:35:32,960
for the stars

853
00:35:37,829 --> 00:35:35,440
hosted by renowned astrophysicist neil

854
00:35:40,310 --> 00:35:37,839
degrasse tyson the series will explore

855
00:35:42,950 --> 00:35:40,320
how we discovered the laws of nature and

856
00:35:45,670 --> 00:35:42,960
found our coordinates in space and time

857
00:35:47,990 --> 00:35:45,680
it will bring to life never before told

858
00:35:50,630 --> 00:35:48,000
stories of the heroic quest for

859
00:35:53,349 --> 00:35:50,640
knowledge and transports viewers to new

860
00:35:55,270 --> 00:35:53,359
worlds and across the universe for a

861
00:35:57,190 --> 00:35:55,280
vision of the cosmos

862
00:35:58,790 --> 00:35:57,200
on the grander scale

863
00:36:01,430 --> 00:35:58,800
well that's a good blurb

864
00:36:03,030 --> 00:36:01,440
all 13 episodes of the new cosmos series

865
00:36:07,030 --> 00:36:03,040
on e4

866
00:36:09,430 --> 00:36:07,040
dvd disc set can be yours australian

867
00:36:10,950 --> 00:36:09,440
listeners this is what you have to do

868
00:36:13,109 --> 00:36:10,960
using the theme

869
00:36:15,430 --> 00:36:13,119
billions and billions

870
00:36:19,510 --> 00:36:15,440
send us a photograph

871
00:36:20,910 --> 00:36:19,520
send it to cosmos

872
00:36:24,950 --> 00:36:20,920
at

873
00:36:26,630 --> 00:36:24,960
don't make it too big please nothing

874
00:36:28,150 --> 00:36:26,640
like five megabytes see if you can sort

875
00:36:30,069 --> 00:36:28,160
of crunch it down to

876
00:36:31,109 --> 00:36:30,079
no more than one

877
00:36:32,550 --> 00:36:31,119
for a

878
00:36:35,349 --> 00:36:32,560
convenience sake

879
00:36:38,150 --> 00:36:35,359
we're going to be posting those on the

880
00:36:41,910 --> 00:36:38,160
skeptic zone facebook

881
00:36:43,829 --> 00:36:41,920
group page so there's your mission

882
00:36:46,550 --> 00:36:43,839
should you choose to accept it

883
00:36:49,030 --> 00:36:46,560
send us a photograph

884
00:36:52,390 --> 00:36:49,040
with the theme in mind billions and

885
00:36:55,190 --> 00:36:52,400
billions and the judges will award the

886
00:36:58,470 --> 00:36:55,200
dvd to what they consider to be the most

887
00:37:00,870 --> 00:36:58,480
creative photograph sent in please

888
00:37:02,950 --> 00:37:00,880
include your full name and

889
00:37:05,829 --> 00:37:02,960
your city or town

890
00:37:07,670 --> 00:37:05,839
so there it is the new cosmos dvd set

891
00:37:09,270 --> 00:37:07,680
competition

892
00:37:11,270 --> 00:37:09,280
i'll leave you with a little clip from

893
00:37:12,470 --> 00:37:11,280
the new cosmos series with neil degrasse

894
00:37:13,829 --> 00:37:12,480
tyson

895
00:37:17,829 --> 00:37:13,839
and

896
00:37:19,510 --> 00:37:17,839
carl sagan it's inspiring stuff

897
00:37:21,030 --> 00:37:19,520
carl sagan was a member of voyageur's

898
00:37:23,190 --> 00:37:21,040
imaging team

899
00:37:25,750 --> 00:37:23,200
and it was his idea that voyager take

900
00:37:28,150 --> 00:37:25,760
one last picture

901
00:37:30,470 --> 00:37:28,160
a generation before an astronaut on the

902
00:37:32,630 --> 00:37:30,480
last apollo flight to the moon had taken

903
00:37:33,829 --> 00:37:32,640
a picture of the whole earth

904
00:37:36,790 --> 00:37:33,839
the planet

905
00:37:39,750 --> 00:37:36,800
as a world without borders it became an

906
00:37:41,910 --> 00:37:39,760
icon of a new consciousness

907
00:37:43,430 --> 00:37:41,920
carl realized the next step in this

908
00:37:46,150 --> 00:37:43,440
process

909
00:37:47,990 --> 00:37:46,160
he convinced nasa to turn the voyager 1

910
00:37:50,870 --> 00:37:48,000
camera back towards earth when the

911
00:37:52,710 --> 00:37:50,880
spacecraft went beyond neptune for one

912
00:37:54,550 --> 00:37:52,720
last look homeward

913
00:38:03,030 --> 00:37:54,560
at what he called

914
00:38:06,069 --> 00:38:04,550
that's here

915
00:38:07,750 --> 00:38:06,079
that's home

916
00:38:09,030 --> 00:38:07,760
that's us

917
00:38:10,790 --> 00:38:09,040
on it

918
00:38:12,390 --> 00:38:10,800
everyone you love

919
00:38:15,190 --> 00:38:12,400
everyone you know

920
00:38:17,190 --> 00:38:15,200
everyone you ever heard of every human

921
00:38:19,670 --> 00:38:17,200
being who ever was

922
00:38:23,270 --> 00:38:19,680
lived out their lives

923
00:38:25,430 --> 00:38:23,280
the aggregate of our joy and suffering

924
00:38:28,150 --> 00:38:25,440
thousands of confident religions

925
00:38:30,470 --> 00:38:28,160
ideologies and economic doctrines

926
00:38:33,190 --> 00:38:30,480
every hunter and forager

927
00:38:35,589 --> 00:38:33,200
every hero and coward every creator and

928
00:38:37,829 --> 00:38:35,599
destroyer of civilization

929
00:38:40,390 --> 00:38:37,839
every king and peasant

930
00:38:41,670 --> 00:38:40,400
every young couple in love every mother

931
00:38:43,030 --> 00:38:41,680
and father

932
00:38:45,510 --> 00:38:43,040
hopeful child

933
00:38:47,910 --> 00:38:45,520
inventor and explorer

934
00:38:52,550 --> 00:38:47,920
every teacher of morals every corrupt

935
00:38:55,190 --> 00:38:52,560
politician every superstar every supreme

936
00:38:57,270 --> 00:38:55,200
leader every saint and sinner in the

937
00:38:58,870 --> 00:38:57,280
history of our species

938
00:39:00,710 --> 00:38:58,880
lived there

939
00:39:02,310 --> 00:39:00,720
on a motive dust

940
00:39:04,069 --> 00:39:02,320
suspended

941
00:39:05,270 --> 00:39:04,079
in a sunbeam

942
00:39:08,390 --> 00:39:05,280
the earth

943
00:39:09,829 --> 00:39:08,400
is a very small stage

944
00:39:12,470 --> 00:39:09,839
in a fast

945
00:39:13,270 --> 00:39:12,480
cosmic arena

946
00:39:15,430 --> 00:39:13,280
think

947
00:39:17,510 --> 00:39:15,440
of the rivers of blood

948
00:39:19,349 --> 00:39:17,520
spilled by all those generals and

949
00:39:21,750 --> 00:39:19,359
emperors

950
00:39:24,630 --> 00:39:21,760
so that in glory and triumph they could

951
00:39:26,230 --> 00:39:24,640
become the momentary masters

952
00:39:28,230 --> 00:39:26,240
of a fraction

953
00:39:31,030 --> 00:39:28,240
of a dot

954
00:39:33,190 --> 00:39:31,040
think of the endless cruelties visited

955
00:39:34,470 --> 00:39:33,200
by the inhabitants of one corner of this

956
00:39:36,470 --> 00:39:34,480
pixel

957
00:39:37,829 --> 00:39:36,480
on the scarcely distinguishable

958
00:39:39,510 --> 00:39:37,839
inhabitants

959
00:39:42,550 --> 00:39:39,520
of some other corner

960
00:39:45,510 --> 00:39:42,560
how frequent their misunderstandings

961
00:39:49,190 --> 00:39:45,520
how eager they are to kill one another

962
00:39:51,670 --> 00:39:49,200
how fervent their hatreds

963
00:39:54,710 --> 00:39:51,680
our posturings

964
00:39:56,790 --> 00:39:54,720
our imagined self-importance the

965
00:39:58,710 --> 00:39:56,800
delusion that we have some privileged

966
00:40:00,150 --> 00:39:58,720
position in the universe

967
00:40:03,910 --> 00:40:00,160
are challenged

968
00:40:05,829 --> 00:40:03,920
by this point of pale light

969
00:40:07,910 --> 00:40:05,839
our planet

970
00:40:11,750 --> 00:40:07,920
is a lonely speck

971
00:40:14,630 --> 00:40:11,760
in the great enveloping cosmic dark

972
00:40:17,270 --> 00:40:14,640
in our obscurity

973
00:40:18,870 --> 00:40:17,280
in all this vastness

974
00:40:21,109 --> 00:40:18,880
there is no hint

975
00:40:24,870 --> 00:40:21,119
that help will come from elsewhere

976
00:40:27,349 --> 00:40:24,880
to save us from ourselves the earth is

977
00:40:28,710 --> 00:40:27,359
the only world known so far to harbor

978
00:40:30,950 --> 00:40:28,720
life

979
00:40:32,150 --> 00:40:30,960
there is nowhere else at least in the

980
00:40:35,030 --> 00:40:32,160
near future

981
00:40:36,829 --> 00:40:35,040
to which our species could migrate

982
00:40:39,750 --> 00:40:36,839
visit

983
00:40:40,790 --> 00:40:39,760
yes settle

984
00:40:42,069 --> 00:40:40,800
not yet

985
00:40:43,670 --> 00:40:42,079
like it or not

986
00:40:47,109 --> 00:40:43,680
for the moment

987
00:40:49,190 --> 00:40:47,119
the earth is where we make our stand

988
00:40:50,230 --> 00:40:49,200
it has been said that astronomy is a

989
00:40:51,030 --> 00:40:50,240
humbling

990
00:40:54,069 --> 00:40:51,040
and

991
00:40:56,710 --> 00:40:54,079
character building experience

992
00:40:59,589 --> 00:40:56,720
there is perhaps no better demonstration

993
00:41:03,190 --> 00:40:59,599
of the folly of human conceits

994
00:41:04,390 --> 00:41:03,200
than this distant image

995
00:41:06,870 --> 00:41:04,400
to me

996
00:41:09,430 --> 00:41:06,880
it underscores our responsibility to

997
00:41:11,030 --> 00:41:09,440
deal more kindly with one another

998
00:41:12,309 --> 00:41:11,040
and to preserve

999
00:41:14,069 --> 00:41:12,319
and cherish

1000
00:41:15,589 --> 00:41:14,079
the pale blue dot

1001
00:41:41,990 --> 00:41:15,599
the only home

1002
00:41:51,190 --> 00:41:44,790
let's all take this with a grain of salt

1003
00:41:55,349 --> 00:41:53,510
i'm here with rhys morgan reese for a

1004
00:41:56,630 --> 00:41:55,359
lot of skeptics needs no introduction

1005
00:41:58,870 --> 00:41:56,640
but maybe

1006
00:42:01,270 --> 00:41:58,880
maybe you can tell us those are the few

1007
00:42:03,829 --> 00:42:01,280
listeners who do not know who you are

1008
00:42:05,510 --> 00:42:03,839
do you want to tell them uh

1009
00:42:07,750 --> 00:42:05,520
why people know about you

1010
00:42:08,870 --> 00:42:07,760
um yeah sure a few years ago i was

1011
00:42:10,950 --> 00:42:08,880
involved in

1012
00:42:12,790 --> 00:42:10,960
talking and debunking a miracle mineral

1013
00:42:14,470 --> 00:42:12,800
solution um

1014
00:42:15,910 --> 00:42:14,480
that was the product's name

1015
00:42:18,309 --> 00:42:15,920
it was an industrial bleaching agent

1016
00:42:21,589 --> 00:42:18,319
being promoted as a treatment for

1017
00:42:24,790 --> 00:42:21,599
all sorts of illnesses cancer crohn's

1018
00:42:26,630 --> 00:42:24,800
arthritis tuberculosis and um i got

1019
00:42:28,150 --> 00:42:26,640
involved with

1020
00:42:29,589 --> 00:42:28,160
debunking that and i got the james

1021
00:42:31,190 --> 00:42:29,599
ramsey education

1022
00:42:33,270 --> 00:42:31,200
educational foundation award for

1023
00:42:35,829 --> 00:42:33,280
outstanding contribution to grassroots

1024
00:42:38,230 --> 00:42:35,839
skepticism for that um at town london in

1025
00:42:40,710 --> 00:42:38,240
2010 and then after so maybe we should

1026
00:42:43,190 --> 00:42:40,720
just point out town london 2010 you're

1027
00:42:45,750 --> 00:42:43,200
now almost 20 right yes so you were i

1028
00:42:47,430 --> 00:42:45,760
was 15 16 when yeah that happened very

1029
00:42:49,190 --> 00:42:47,440
good um and then

1030
00:42:51,829 --> 00:42:49,200
a couple a year later or so i got

1031
00:42:53,270 --> 00:42:51,839
involved with um i blogged about a

1032
00:42:55,030 --> 00:42:53,280
clinic called the bazinski clinic in

1033
00:42:56,390 --> 00:42:55,040
america who are a cancer clinic who

1034
00:42:57,910 --> 00:42:56,400
offer a treatment called antenna

1035
00:42:59,589 --> 00:42:57,920
plastons

1036
00:43:01,270 --> 00:42:59,599
there there's no scientific evidence

1037
00:43:04,150 --> 00:43:01,280
that they work or are effective in the

1038
00:43:04,950 --> 00:43:04,160
treatment of cancer but uh dr bazinski

1039
00:43:08,630 --> 00:43:04,960
will

1040
00:43:10,550 --> 00:43:08,640
treatment or cure and people pay

1041
00:43:12,630 --> 00:43:10,560
hundreds of thousands of dollars to go

1042
00:43:15,109 --> 00:43:12,640
over to his clinic to get this treatment

1043
00:43:17,510 --> 00:43:15,119
so i blogged about this i said this is

1044
00:43:20,630 --> 00:43:17,520
wrong this shouldn't be happening um and

1045
00:43:21,349 --> 00:43:20,640
i was almost sued by him for it he hired

1046
00:43:51,829 --> 00:43:21,359
a

1047
00:43:55,349 --> 00:43:51,839
you come to

1048
00:43:58,230 --> 00:43:55,359
something like this uh qed a skeptical

1049
00:44:00,470 --> 00:43:58,240
conference and uh you're a bit of a

1050
00:44:02,630 --> 00:44:00,480
local celebrity aren't you it is a bit

1051
00:44:04,150 --> 00:44:02,640
different from my normal life because

1052
00:44:05,910 --> 00:44:04,160
you know when i walk around cardiff my

1053
00:44:07,270 --> 00:44:05,920
hometown you know nobody pays any

1054
00:44:09,670 --> 00:44:07,280
attention to me really except my friends

1055
00:44:11,109 --> 00:44:09,680
and then um when i come to qed i have

1056
00:44:13,270 --> 00:44:11,119
people come up to me and just be like oh

1057
00:44:15,510 --> 00:44:13,280
hi rhys hi recent it's quite odd

1058
00:44:17,589 --> 00:44:15,520
especially when you have people that you

1059
00:44:19,430 --> 00:44:17,599
you don't know but they know you it

1060
00:44:21,270 --> 00:44:19,440
could be quite quite

1061
00:44:23,190 --> 00:44:21,280
like me for example

1062
00:44:26,390 --> 00:44:23,200
okay and then they drag you to a back

1063
00:44:29,589 --> 00:44:28,309
so so um

1064
00:44:31,829 --> 00:44:29,599
first of all obviously the story with

1065
00:44:33,430 --> 00:44:31,839
brazilian brzezinski actually um it

1066
00:44:34,829 --> 00:44:33,440
hasn't ended yet but it's it's

1067
00:44:37,270 --> 00:44:34,839
definitely going in the right direction

1068
00:44:39,030 --> 00:44:37,280
there's even just just recently there's

1069
00:44:40,790 --> 00:44:39,040
been a lot of news about he's basically

1070
00:44:43,349 --> 00:44:40,800
not allowed to provide that treatment

1071
00:44:45,510 --> 00:44:43,359
anymore yeah indeed so so this obviously

1072
00:44:49,109 --> 00:44:45,520
has led to significant

1073
00:44:50,390 --> 00:44:49,119
um significant positive changes now

1074
00:44:53,510 --> 00:44:50,400
you had to

1075
00:44:55,750 --> 00:44:53,520
uh show quite a bit of strength i would

1076
00:44:57,829 --> 00:44:55,760
say uh at the time you mean you were

1077
00:44:59,990 --> 00:44:57,839
threatened being with being sued so so

1078
00:45:01,910 --> 00:45:00,000
can you tell us about that and how you

1079
00:45:04,150 --> 00:45:01,920
felt and how you actually dealt with it

1080
00:45:06,710 --> 00:45:04,160
yeah it was it was uh

1081
00:45:08,630 --> 00:45:06,720
it was awkward at the time because i was

1082
00:45:10,870 --> 00:45:08,640
doing my a levels for the first time and

1083
00:45:12,790 --> 00:45:10,880
i was stressed because of those and then

1084
00:45:14,230 --> 00:45:12,800
i received an email from mark stevens

1085
00:45:16,230 --> 00:45:14,240
threatening to sue me for libel if i

1086
00:45:17,910 --> 00:45:16,240
didn't take the blog post down and given

1087
00:45:19,589 --> 00:45:17,920
the state of the uk's libel laws at the

1088
00:45:20,550 --> 00:45:19,599
time we hadn't had any sort of libel

1089
00:45:21,829 --> 00:45:20,560
reform

1090
00:45:24,309 --> 00:45:21,839
um

1091
00:45:26,069 --> 00:45:24,319
being made into law yet so

1092
00:45:27,910 --> 00:45:26,079
i was quite quite nervous you know at

1093
00:45:29,349 --> 00:45:27,920
first i thought well i'm on the right

1094
00:45:32,150 --> 00:45:29,359
side here you know i've definitely told

1095
00:45:33,990 --> 00:45:32,160
the truth so i've not libeled him but at

1096
00:45:35,990 --> 00:45:34,000
the same time i knew the costs of a

1097
00:45:37,829 --> 00:45:36,000
liable case and the stress of a libel

1098
00:45:41,109 --> 00:45:37,839
case regardless of whether you've said

1099
00:45:42,870 --> 00:45:41,119
the truth or not uh extortionate so it

1100
00:45:44,870 --> 00:45:42,880
was quite stressful um but then i was

1101
00:45:47,910 --> 00:45:44,880
able to get in contact with simon singh

1102
00:45:50,390 --> 00:45:47,920
who um got in touch with robert dugans

1103
00:45:51,589 --> 00:45:50,400
and they both helped me um

1104
00:45:53,109 --> 00:45:51,599
sort of

1105
00:45:54,790 --> 00:45:53,119
make sure that

1106
00:45:56,630 --> 00:45:54,800
robert stevens is uh simon singh's

1107
00:45:58,309 --> 00:45:56,640
lawyer or solicitor

1108
00:46:00,309 --> 00:45:58,319
and he helped him throughout the british

1109
00:46:01,349 --> 00:46:00,319
chiropractic association versus singh

1110
00:46:04,550 --> 00:46:01,359
case

1111
00:46:06,309 --> 00:46:04,560
um and they both helped write emails to

1112
00:46:09,109 --> 00:46:06,319
send back to mark stevens and write a

1113
00:46:10,230 --> 00:46:09,119
new blog post detailing exactly what had

1114
00:46:11,349 --> 00:46:10,240
happened you know how i'd been

1115
00:46:13,109 --> 00:46:11,359
threatened

1116
00:46:15,750 --> 00:46:13,119
um so that i was able to put that up

1117
00:46:17,109 --> 00:46:15,760
later on after it was established that

1118
00:46:18,230 --> 00:46:17,119
they weren't they weren't going to sue

1119
00:46:20,230 --> 00:46:18,240
me

1120
00:46:22,390 --> 00:46:20,240
okay so

1121
00:46:24,550 --> 00:46:22,400
how long was all of that this this all

1122
00:46:26,470 --> 00:46:24,560
took place over about uh the space of

1123
00:46:28,309 --> 00:46:26,480
about a month i would say um it was the

1124
00:46:30,069 --> 00:46:28,319
start of november um that i got the

1125
00:46:33,349 --> 00:46:30,079
first email and then i had a back and

1126
00:46:35,430 --> 00:46:33,359
forth between mark stevens and myself um

1127
00:46:36,470 --> 00:46:35,440
with a lot of input from robert dugans

1128
00:46:39,190 --> 00:46:36,480
and simon

1129
00:46:40,710 --> 00:46:39,200
um to help write the emails back

1130
00:46:42,069 --> 00:46:40,720
and then eventually they suggested they

1131
00:46:44,069 --> 00:46:42,079
were going to get another law firm

1132
00:46:45,030 --> 00:46:44,079
involved as in the business clinic said

1133
00:46:47,109 --> 00:46:45,040
they were going to get another law firm

1134
00:46:48,470 --> 00:46:47,119
involved and that fizzled away into

1135
00:46:50,390 --> 00:46:48,480
nothing thankfully

1136
00:46:52,550 --> 00:46:50,400
i see and um what have you been doing

1137
00:46:53,990 --> 00:46:52,560
since i mean it's been it's been quite a

1138
00:46:55,829 --> 00:46:54,000
while i'm assuming that you've been

1139
00:46:58,790 --> 00:46:55,839
quite active in the meantime yeah um

1140
00:47:01,990 --> 00:46:58,800
sort of helping in the background to

1141
00:47:04,309 --> 00:47:02,000
against the bezinski case still um like

1142
00:47:05,910 --> 00:47:04,319
there are other skeptics in the us as

1143
00:47:08,550 --> 00:47:05,920
well such as bob blaskovich who've

1144
00:47:11,030 --> 00:47:08,560
really taken the lead in um

1145
00:47:12,470 --> 00:47:11,040
sort of the public information side of

1146
00:47:13,990 --> 00:47:12,480
getting the bazinski story across he

1147
00:47:15,829 --> 00:47:14,000
runs um

1148
00:47:17,910 --> 00:47:15,839
a group called skeptics

1149
00:47:20,470 --> 00:47:17,920
for the protection of cancer patients

1150
00:47:21,750 --> 00:47:20,480
and um so i've sort of been helping and

1151
00:47:24,790 --> 00:47:21,760
they have a couple of websites right

1152
00:47:26,150 --> 00:47:24,800
there in texas houston kansas yeah the

1153
00:47:27,109 --> 00:47:26,160
houston cancer quack and that's a you

1154
00:47:29,109 --> 00:47:27,119
know it's a brilliant resource of

1155
00:47:29,829 --> 00:47:29,119
patients who the other and also the

1156
00:47:34,230 --> 00:47:29,839
other

1157
00:47:36,309 --> 00:47:34,240
yeah that's the one yeah yeah and they

1158
00:47:37,750 --> 00:47:36,319
on that you can find details of uh

1159
00:47:39,589 --> 00:47:37,760
patients who've gone to pozinski and

1160
00:47:42,390 --> 00:47:39,599
then have not been successful which is

1161
00:47:44,550 --> 00:47:42,400
the majority of them um so you can find

1162
00:47:46,630 --> 00:47:44,560
all their stories on that website um but

1163
00:47:48,630 --> 00:47:46,640
other campaigns that he's helped you

1164
00:47:50,309 --> 00:47:48,640
know he's run have been like letter

1165
00:47:53,030 --> 00:47:50,319
writing campaigns to

1166
00:47:54,230 --> 00:47:53,040
senators in the u.s um and so i've been

1167
00:47:56,150 --> 00:47:54,240
sort of

1168
00:47:57,750 --> 00:47:56,160
not taking a uh

1169
00:47:59,349 --> 00:47:57,760
a disinterest in it but sort of taking

1170
00:48:01,750 --> 00:47:59,359
more of a back seat while

1171
00:48:02,550 --> 00:48:01,760
bob's been continuing the work

1172
00:48:05,990 --> 00:48:02,560
so

1173
00:48:07,670 --> 00:48:06,000
slightly recently was multi-level

1174
00:48:08,870 --> 00:48:07,680
marketing but some of my friends got

1175
00:48:11,109 --> 00:48:08,880
involved in a multi-level marketing

1176
00:48:14,870 --> 00:48:11,119
scheme um and so i decided to write

1177
00:48:15,829 --> 00:48:14,880
about um how things like herbalife and

1178
00:48:16,870 --> 00:48:15,839
um

1179
00:48:18,390 --> 00:48:16,880
all these other multiple marketing

1180
00:48:21,430 --> 00:48:18,400
schemes aren't actually you know the

1181
00:48:22,549 --> 00:48:21,440
savior for people you know that they're

1182
00:48:24,549 --> 00:48:22,559
not going to actually make you into

1183
00:48:26,309 --> 00:48:24,559
multi-millionaires unless you're you

1184
00:48:28,470 --> 00:48:26,319
know one in a million or something

1185
00:48:30,870 --> 00:48:28,480
yeah well yeah it's not just that they

1186
00:48:33,349 --> 00:48:30,880
won't help you become a millionaire that

1187
00:48:35,109 --> 00:48:33,359
they're unlikely to

1188
00:48:38,230 --> 00:48:35,119
make you any profit most people just

1189
00:48:40,950 --> 00:48:38,240
make a few dollars at most per month on

1190
00:48:42,549 --> 00:48:40,960
average or you might even end up with uh

1191
00:48:43,829 --> 00:48:42,559
debt because you've bought a significant

1192
00:48:45,430 --> 00:48:43,839
amount of stock that they've promised

1193
00:48:48,309 --> 00:48:45,440
you'd be able to sell and you've not

1194
00:48:50,950 --> 00:48:48,319
been able to sell it and you know yes

1195
00:48:52,230 --> 00:48:50,960
it's a bit of a scam yeah so so this is

1196
00:48:53,990 --> 00:48:52,240
your focus at the moment from a

1197
00:48:56,230 --> 00:48:54,000
skeptical perspective yeah i'd like to

1198
00:48:57,829 --> 00:48:56,240
do more on um sort of like taking down

1199
00:48:59,990 --> 00:48:57,839
multi-level marketing schemes it's a bit

1200
00:49:02,710 --> 00:49:00,000
bit of a big deal because they're you

1201
00:49:04,390 --> 00:49:02,720
know you see herbalife on rugby sponsor

1202
00:49:06,230 --> 00:49:04,400
shirts and all that sort of thing so

1203
00:49:09,030 --> 00:49:06,240
they're probably even more or even

1204
00:49:11,589 --> 00:49:09,040
bigger than brzezinski at the moment and

1205
00:49:13,589 --> 00:49:11,599
there are so many of them that it's

1206
00:49:15,030 --> 00:49:13,599
it'd be an interesting challenge to take

1207
00:49:17,030 --> 00:49:15,040
on

1208
00:49:19,030 --> 00:49:17,040
very good uh reese thank you very much

1209
00:49:21,030 --> 00:49:19,040
for for everything you've done for for

1210
00:49:35,109 --> 00:49:21,040
skepticism and for this interview thank

1211
00:49:38,790 --> 00:49:36,710
hey this is jay novella from the

1212
00:49:40,390 --> 00:49:38,800
skeptic's guide to the universe podcast

1213
00:49:42,150 --> 00:49:40,400
did you know that there are thousands of

1214
00:49:44,630 --> 00:49:42,160
skeptical reports interviews and

1215
00:49:49,510 --> 00:49:44,640
investigations going back to 1981 free

1216
00:49:53,190 --> 00:49:51,270
click the publications link and enjoy

1217
00:49:55,270 --> 00:49:53,200
almost every back issue of the skeptic

1218
00:49:57,030 --> 00:49:55,280
the journal from australian skeptics you

1219
00:49:59,190 --> 00:49:57,040
can also subscribe online and get the

1220
00:50:01,349 --> 00:49:59,200
latest digital or hard copy of this the

1221
00:50:03,549 --> 00:50:01,359
world's second oldest skeptical magazine

1222
00:50:05,430 --> 00:50:03,559
that's

1223
00:50:23,589 --> 00:50:05,440
www.skeptics.com.au or just google

1224
00:50:27,109 --> 00:50:25,430
thank you for listening to the skeptic

1225
00:50:30,309 --> 00:50:27,119
zone and as i mentioned at the top of

1226
00:50:33,030 --> 00:50:30,319
the show uh james randy is coming out to

1227
00:50:35,670 --> 00:50:33,040
australia in december to do a series of

1228
00:50:38,150 --> 00:50:35,680
talks in perth brisbane melbourne sydney

1229
00:50:40,470 --> 00:50:38,160
i i think i've got that correct look i'm

1230
00:50:42,870 --> 00:50:40,480
going to be having a chat to james well

1231
00:50:44,230 --> 00:50:42,880
in the coming weeks or months about this

1232
00:50:46,150 --> 00:50:44,240
and i'll bring you that on the skeptic

1233
00:50:48,309 --> 00:50:46,160
zone but keep an eye out for that an

1234
00:50:49,589 --> 00:50:48,319
evening of james randy are they going to

1235
00:50:51,990 --> 00:50:49,599
be showing the

1236
00:50:53,910 --> 00:50:52,000
honest liar the documentary about james

1237
00:50:55,430 --> 00:50:53,920
randy but i'll try to bring you more

1238
00:50:58,309 --> 00:50:55,440
information

1239
00:51:01,190 --> 00:50:58,319
about that as it comes to hand always

1240
00:51:02,870 --> 00:51:01,200
good to see james randy in australia

1241
00:51:04,470 --> 00:51:02,880
james randy in australia and that's the

1242
00:51:06,510 --> 00:51:04,480
name of the documentary that was made

1243
00:51:09,109 --> 00:51:06,520
way back in 1981

1244
00:51:10,549 --> 00:51:09,119
1981 all about james randy doing water

1245
00:51:11,750 --> 00:51:10,559
divining tests

1246
00:51:14,710 --> 00:51:11,760
google it

1247
00:51:15,829 --> 00:51:14,720
james randy in australia it's a

1248
00:51:19,589 --> 00:51:15,839
wonderful

1249
00:51:21,750 --> 00:51:19,599
documentary about 45 minutes i guess

1250
00:51:23,510 --> 00:51:21,760
all about water divining

1251
00:51:25,270 --> 00:51:23,520
and that helped kick off australian

1252
00:51:27,030 --> 00:51:25,280
skeptics all those years ago

1253
00:51:28,710 --> 00:51:27,040
but for now this is oh all right all

1254
00:51:30,230 --> 00:51:28,720
right all those people who write in to

1255
00:51:33,030 --> 00:51:30,240
me and ask me to do this i'll do it

1256
00:51:38,069 --> 00:51:36,069
i've got my ten sided die here

1257
00:51:40,549 --> 00:51:38,079
i think i've got this at dragon con

1258
00:51:43,190 --> 00:51:40,559
sort of red and

1259
00:51:44,069 --> 00:51:43,200
wine colored red wine colored bright red

1260
00:51:45,510 --> 00:51:44,079
anyway

1261
00:51:48,390 --> 00:51:45,520
ten sided

1262
00:51:51,750 --> 00:51:48,400
numbers from one to ten

1263
00:51:53,430 --> 00:51:51,760
or zero to nine we'll call it one to ten

1264
00:51:55,589 --> 00:51:53,440
give this a shake

1265
00:51:58,710 --> 00:51:55,599
so use your uh psychic powers folks

1266
00:52:00,630 --> 00:51:58,720
think now look into the future

1267
00:52:02,790 --> 00:52:00,640
will it roll a one two three four five

1268
00:52:09,030 --> 00:52:02,800
six seven eight nine or ten how psychic

1269
00:52:13,349 --> 00:52:10,950
seven

1270
00:52:15,430 --> 00:52:13,359
want to try another one

1271
00:52:17,670 --> 00:52:15,440
here we go

1272
00:52:22,390 --> 00:52:17,680
look into the future guess that number

1273
00:52:27,190 --> 00:52:25,030
seven what

1274
00:52:28,870 --> 00:52:27,200
this can't be of course of course it can

1275
00:52:30,790 --> 00:52:28,880
one more go one more go just to prove

1276
00:52:32,309 --> 00:52:30,800
it's not loaded or anything shake shake

1277
00:52:34,309 --> 00:52:32,319
shake look into the future guess that

1278
00:52:39,109 --> 00:52:34,319
number here we go

1279
00:52:43,349 --> 00:52:40,470
two

1280
00:52:47,030 --> 00:52:43,359
all those people who got 772

1281
00:52:48,870 --> 00:52:47,040
you win some homeopathic coconut water

1282
00:52:53,910 --> 00:52:48,880
but for now this is richard saunders

1283
00:52:57,589 --> 00:52:55,589
you've been listening to the skeptic

1284
00:53:00,950 --> 00:52:57,599
zone visit our website at